GJ: You’ve spent almost 20 years at Milliman, firstly in marketing and then as its global social impact and sustainability officer. Was this an organic progression or did you actively seek out the opportunity to apply your skills to what is perhaps the most pressing issue of our time?

PC: It was a bit of both. As chief marketing officer, I was seeing increasingly specific questions around the firm’s ESG practices, policies, and programmes. Milliman is a very de-centralised firm – with 70 offices around the world. While there were great things happening throughout our firm, no one was tracking it, measuring it, guiding or leading. Just a lot of “random acts of kindness.”

Since we weren’t tracking or measuring – it was difficult to respond to the tender/RFP questions holistically. Eventually, we had one firm client dismiss us as their provider because our answers to the ESG portion of the questionnaire were “insufficient to meet our expectations.” They moved on.

At that point, the board realised we needed to formally address our social impact and sustainability practices. They sent me back to graduate school – and I moved into a brand-new role – social impact and sustainability officer. I am still with Milliman part-time – but now also have a consulting practice, Amity Advisory, to help other professional services firms prepare for growing client and other stakeholder expectations.

GJ: Has a global pandemic focused us? Or is there a danger that with everything else with which we’ve had (and have) to contend ESG issues may get left behind?

PC: Yes, the global pandemic has laid bare much of what was always wrong with society – but was perhaps more hidden. It has raised awareness exponentially – and it seems to me that businesses will never be able to go back to what we used to consider “normal” – as perhaps it never really should have been. Stakeholders will not allow us to slip back (I hope.)

GJ: You set-up Amity Advisory in 2018. “Holistic” seems to key to your approach and I imagine that’s the only way forward? Tell us a little about its work?

PC: I focus on “holistic” because, historically, firms function in very siloed ways. There are separate and distinct practices groups and departments serving clients. There is a separate department or team working on pro-bono. There might be a few operations people focused on sustainability – and perhaps even a separate committee of employee volunteers working on day of service type events or on philanthropy. This is what I call “transactional” ESG. To truly get to “transformational” ESG – all these efforts and work must be aligned. This allows for the greatest impact on society – and the greatest, holistic story to tell about the outcomes and impact.

GJ: Without wanting to set-up barriers, are there generational differences and challenges when it comes to social impact and sustainability and how it’s tackled in business?

PC: Yes. In firms – it’ s often the more senior partners in decision-making positions. Unfortunately, they are often those who do not see the urgency of ESG – for their own firm or for their clients’ long-term viability. The younger generation gets it – and understands ESG considerations must drive business decisions – rather than be a side-activity. Every firm governing body should have a position for someone younger than 30!

GJ: We have a leading businesswoman in the UK called Mary Portas and her big thing is “the kindness economy”. She says businesses are now being judged to much higher standards by customers, clients, partners, and perspective employees – and we ignore that at our peril. Have you a view?

PC: I completely agree. We’ve learned that shareholder primacy at all costs is not sustainable or viable long-term. All stakeholders must be taken into consideration for every decision being made. Businesses cannot survive in societies that fail. The pandemic has shown us that.